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by anon-a4e4
How is this not going to increase the demand and black market and how will they prevent obvious corruption (the kind that got this pushed through) from allowing people to mark poached products as farm made? This is a tragedy for these amazing animals - the Chinese should be ashamed.
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7M ago
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7M ago
By Jean O'Boyle
How much of this unnecessary slaughter is for the "aphrodisiacs" market? Not a knock against sex - it's about money earned from the gullible.
By Mark Tracey
Your response could apply to any nonessential discretionary purchase.
Starbucks? Cosmetics? 60"flat screen TVs? All take their toll on the natural world.
Starbucks? Cosmetics? 60"flat screen TVs? All take their toll on the natural world.
by anon-a4e4
You are comparing the impact of killing the last of the world's tigers to powder their bones and make fake medicine to the impact of buying a coffee at Starbucks? This is called false equivalence - like your president does when he compares Nazis and their opponents. But I'm surprised you'd even do that here - I've understood you have no compassion for your fellow man (i.e. you are Republican), but why would you want the last of the world's rhinos and tigers killed? Obviously "farming" will be just a cover for the black market - or do we have to have the "well, I told you so" discussion when the animals are extinct?
By Jean O'Boyle
What is the meaning behind Mark's avatar: one actually listening to someone, or the other person whispering bad things about people they don't like? Or is it just stylish folk art/street art to make him look hip?
By Jean O'Boyle
Yes, because you're not a vain, selfish person …
By Jean O'Boyle
Yes, Mark, because you're not a vain, selfish hypocrite yourself?
By Mark Tracey
I don’t think for a moment that you are stupid, so the only explanation is intentional misunderstanding on your part.
And why do you bring Trump into this? Is it some sort of dog whistle or perhaps virtue signaling?
The point “farming” as you put it, is that provides the product desired without poachers having to decimate the wild populations of these animals. The “farmers” have a financial interest in maintaining and growing their animal for the sake of their personal financial interests which coincidentally benefits the survival as well as and growing the numbers of these rare species. Without this the animal farming practices, poaches will eventually wipe these two species out.
And why do you bring Trump into this? Is it some sort of dog whistle or perhaps virtue signaling?
The point “farming” as you put it, is that provides the product desired without poachers having to decimate the wild populations of these animals. The “farmers” have a financial interest in maintaining and growing their animal for the sake of their personal financial interests which coincidentally benefits the survival as well as and growing the numbers of these rare species. Without this the animal farming practices, poaches will eventually wipe these two species out.
By Mark Tracey
It is Athena and Odysseus. I used the image to signify speaking and listening to one another, but there doesn’t seem to be much of either on TOK.
By Mark Tracey
Explain how you have come to your conclusions.
How do you perceive that I am vain?
What makes you think I am selfish?
What specifically have I been hypocritical about?
How do you perceive that I am vain?
What makes you think I am selfish?
What specifically have I been hypocritical about?
by anon-a4e4
In a perfect world yes, but we live in the most imperfect of worlds here. Look at blood diamonds. Essentially the same thing where the Kimberly process was supposed to stop blood diamonds. Except some corrupt governments just stamped the blood diamonds as certified and nothing changed. I don't trust the Chinese at all to deal with this effectively and even if the top rung intends it, lower rungs will torpedo it. My prediction: you will hear vague claims of corruption and cheating always denied and then 10 years from now rhinos will be extinct in the wild. A special report on CNN will show that the Chinese systematically allowed falsely labeled products into their country. Trump will call it fake news during a White House fireside chat as he lies on his new Burmese tigerskin rug.
Trump is a dog whistle - anything evil, anything wrong, anything immoral and anything violating American values established over the last century - instantly brings to mind Trump. I literally tell my children we're ashamed to have such a vulgar and vile man as president. It is repulsive that we have a leader - someone children should look up to and emulate - who is a pig of a human.
Trump is a dog whistle - anything evil, anything wrong, anything immoral and anything violating American values established over the last century - instantly brings to mind Trump. I literally tell my children we're ashamed to have such a vulgar and vile man as president. It is repulsive that we have a leader - someone children should look up to and emulate - who is a pig of a human.
By Mark Tracey
Tell me how you really feel....
It seems in our corrupt world, you would continue to not try to counter the poachers with a method of sustaining the population s of these rare animals because it might not work. Even if the poaching isn’t stopped, thes farms still have viable breeding stocks of these animals that might someday be used to reintroduce them into the wild.
It seems in our corrupt world, you would continue to not try to counter the poachers with a method of sustaining the population s of these rare animals because it might not work. Even if the poaching isn’t stopped, thes farms still have viable breeding stocks of these animals that might someday be used to reintroduce them into the wild.
by anon-a4e4
For that we have zoos. The goal is not to let the animal go extinct in the wild. This is the "all god's creatures are there for us to use and abuse" view of the world.
How about a different policy: anyone caught with rhino or tiger parts will be executed, whether seller or buyer?
I am in favor. That would work better.
How about a different policy: anyone caught with rhino or tiger parts will be executed, whether seller or buyer?
I am in favor. That would work better.
By Mark Tracey
Zoos are one approach, but how has that been working to help this situation, it’s only gotten worse. Why close off other options, the operators of the farms have their financial interest aligned with the general well being propagation to increase the numbers of these rare animals.
As far as executions of poachers, trafficers and buyers of these illegal products, it is a primitive barbaric response.
As far as executions of poachers, trafficers and buyers of these illegal products, it is a primitive barbaric response.
by anon-a4e4
I'm not sure what's barbaric about this - you are trying to save the last of the world's creatures as people criminally (both morally and legally) play with and consume their bones for magic powers. Who is the primitive here?
The farmed products will increase the demand since it gives this nonsense legitimacy and the poachers will find ways to get their products labeled farm. The products will be expensive but legal to sell and this will further increase pressure on the remaining wild population. You may fool yourself into thinking that this isn't a recipe for the end of the animals in the wild, but then, you'd be a fool :)
Oh and the goal is NOT to keep wildlife alive in zoos and kill them everywhere else (i.e. zoos are NOT a solution, except to the need to preserve more of the species for breeding).
The farmed products will increase the demand since it gives this nonsense legitimacy and the poachers will find ways to get their products labeled farm. The products will be expensive but legal to sell and this will further increase pressure on the remaining wild population. You may fool yourself into thinking that this isn't a recipe for the end of the animals in the wild, but then, you'd be a fool :)
Oh and the goal is NOT to keep wildlife alive in zoos and kill them everywhere else (i.e. zoos are NOT a solution, except to the need to preserve more of the species for breeding).
By Mark Tracey
You haven't learned about supply and demand?
if the market for these products increases, the supply for profit will also increase. A portion of those profits could be allocated to sustain and protect the wild stock.
if the market for these products increases, the supply for profit will also increase. A portion of those profits could be allocated to sustain and protect the wild stock.
China ends ban on selling farmed tiger, rhino parts for 'medicine.' Is that OK?
The ban had been in place for 25 years but China says farmed parts can now be used. Is this sustainable or will it doom the species?