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Topic: LGBT

Trump admin backs baker who refused to make cake for same-sex marriage. Agree?

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Discussion started by Tok Staff:
The Trump administration has filed a friend of the court motion supporting a Colorado baker who refused to bake a cake for same-sex wedding. Makes sense?
Background article: ... Read more
Results in this view: Y-violates Faith 22% - Convince Me 0% - N-discrimination 78%
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By Randy Bozarth Yes, I wouldn't want to have anything to do with a same-sex marriage because of my faith.
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By Adrian Moris No. You are merely being discriminatory. There is absolutely NOTHING in the Christian faith that says you can't do business with non-believers. Baking a cake does not doom you to marrying the same sex, not does it even ask you to engage in same sex behavior.
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By Randy Bozarth Homosexuality is condemned in the bible, and I will have nothing to do with a same-sex marriage. Call it discrimination if you want, but I stand by my faith.
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by anon-e854 And so is shaving sideburns, eating different foods from same field and getting married more than once.
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By Randy Bozarth Shaving sideburns and eating different food from the same field, I have never read of being condemned. If they are, it must be in the Old Testament, which Christians are not under. Yes, divorce is a sin, except for the cause of fornication. Matthew 5:31, 32 A widow is permitted to remarry. Romans 7:1-3
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By Vincent D'Emidio Do you actually let a 2,000 year old book tell you how to run your life?
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By Randy Bozarth Yes, it is the word of God. It's not just a book. It's not a dead letter. The word of God is living. Hebrews 4:12 The book is not alive, but the word is. The word of the Lord endures forever. 1 Peter 1:25
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By Dan Anderson Randy - oh, I see. You do not follow the Old Testament? So, the 10 Commandments do not apply to you, even though Jesus said that the Old Testament was to be followed? Interesting.
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By Dan Anderson Randy - Please prove that the Bible is, indeed, the "Word of God". Show your evidence to prove to unbelievers and others that the God of Abraham, as worshipped by Jews, Christians and Muslims, is real and not based solely on faith.
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By Randy Bozarth You believe the scientific evidence supports evolution. I believe the scientific evidence supports the creation. The theory of evolution defies the first two laws of aerodynamics and the law of biogenesis.
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By Randy Bozarth "It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth..." Isaiah 40:22 How did Isaiah know the earth was a sphere centuries before Jesus was on the earth, and thousands of years before Columbus and Magellan sailed the seas to prove it.
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By Dan Anderson Randy - are you still sticking to the claim that Evolution defies the first two laws of aerodynamics? Maybe for birds, but for anything else in that particular science, it has NOTHING to do with aerodynamics.

Also, evolution has nothing to do with either biogenesis or abiogenesis.

I gave you a long list of sites which are scientific in nature which prove Evolution.

Please learn the definition of "scientific theory" - given you have absolutely no idea what it is.
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By Dan Anderson Randy - there were quite a few Greek people who were able to actually measure the circumference of the earth way before the "birth of Jesus". They KNEW it was a sphere and not a circle as the bible states.
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By Randy Bozarth I am not going to convince you that the bible is the word of God. You are too biased towards evolution. Please do not bother me anymore. I stated my belief. If you can't accept the evidence, it is your decision.
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By Dan Anderson Randy - I accept that you have Christian beliefs. But to call your faith evidence is dishonest. When you do not offer any evidence and claim to have done so, are you not breaking the Ninth Commandment?

You seem to not understand, also, that the majority of Christians know that Evolution is also fact.
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By Randy Bozarth All the evidence from the bible itself, the laws of nature, scientific evidence and scientific laws point to the creation and the bible being true. If you don't see it, I can't help that.
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By Dan Anderson Randy - all you have offered is assumption. The same thing could be said about the Upanishads and various Sutras and Vedas.

Again, there is no scientific evidence for the Global Flood of Noah as described in Genesis.

So, again, when you can come up with some objective empirical evidence and not just the Bible proving itself because it says it is true, then let's talk. Until then, I can only assume you have nothing more than blind faith.

Thanks for your time.
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By Randy Bozarth They have proven scientifically that if something is submerged in water for an extended period of time, if it is tested, it will appear much older than it is. If the flood covered the highest mountains with water enough that Noah's ark could float over them for over a year, the entire earth should appear older than it is.
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By Daria Christine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adelphopoiesis

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by anon-e854 Don't be in a public service business then. If you feel that way go into a church occupation. You serve the public when you open a public business.
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By Randy Bozarth I'm not in public service, but if I was, I wouldn't cater to a same-sex marriage. The law only applies to Christians if it doesn't violate the faith of Jesus Christ. I don't have to bake a cake for a same-sex marriage. I would rather go to jail.
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By Vincent D'Emidio Is it because of your "faith" or your Prejudices?
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By Randy Bozarth Homosexuality is a sin. Paul said, "Now concerning the things whereof ye wrote unto me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman. Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband." 1 Corinthians 7:1, 2 In chapter 6:9, 10 it says that homosexuals are among those who will not inherit the kingdom of God. No one is born homosexual. It is a choice.
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By William Dykeman according to who, the bible constantly contradicts itself and christians seem only to pick the parts of the bible they like and ignore others like this... Luke 3:11 ►
Verse (Click for Chapter)
New International Version
John answered, "Anyone who has two shirts should share with the one who has none, and anyone who has food should do the same."

New Living Translation
John replied, "If you have two shirts, give one to the poor. If you have food, share it with those who are hungry."
funny how you bible bangers forget that part..
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By Randy Bozarth Both those versions of the bible are unreliable. They are not versions of the bible. They are perversions of the bible. The most accurate version is the American Standard Version.
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By William Dykeman New American Standard Bible
And he would answer and say to them, "The man who has two tunics is to share with him who has none; and he who has food is to do likewise."
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By Randy Bozarth What is the contradiction? I don't see it.
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By William Dykeman look harder with your eyes open moron
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By William Dykeman New American Standard Bible
And he would answer and say to them, "The man who has two tunics is to share with him who has none; and he who has food is to do likewise."
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By William Dykeman https://infidels.org/library/modern/donald_morgan/contradictions.html
GE 1:14-19 The sun (which separates night and day) wasn't created until the fourth day.

GE 1:11-12, 26-27 Trees were created before man was created.
GE 2:4-9 Man was created before trees were created.
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By Randy Bozarth You are reading something out of the bible that is not there. Just because it says he put trees in the garden, after he says he created man, does not mean he put trees in the garden after he created man. He just says it after he created man. I could make a lot of things contradict if I tried to.
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By William Dykeman you are so pathetic
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By William Dykeman there you go pushing your religion on others, keep it to yourself!
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By Randy Bozarth I am not pushing my religion on anyone. I would not bake a cake for a same-sex marriage. Go to another baker.
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By William Dykeman then you belong in jail..with the tax evaders .. and the people who do illegal drugs and own machine guns.. call me a fascst i dont care you dont respect our rights.. i'd line you up against a wall if a could.. see how that works? maybe you need to rethink your hate it is contagious and not all of us are pasifists.. get it? think about it carefully
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By William Dykeman yeah you are
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By Randy Bozarth I don't hate anyone. You seem to have hatred for me. I pray for all men, like the bible says. I would love to hear that a homosexual repented, and obeyed the gospel, or all of them. God is not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. You probably own a gun.
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By William Dykeman yeah you do.. dont lie
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By Randy Bozarth You are quite hateful toward me, and you are harassing me. I'd like to report you to the authorities for harassment. There is still freedom of religion in this country. I have the freedom to worship God. Like I said, Go to another baker!
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By William Dykeman and i have the freedom to harass your superstitious bottom
stop thinking your backwards religion gives you some sort of special status.. and even if it did i would ignore it.. i am at war with your kind.. all of you.. and that is my constitutional right.. p%^sy
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By Randy Bozarth If you have the right to harass me because of my right to my own faith, then I have the right to harass homosexuals on the basis of my faith.
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By William Dykeman yes i do if you dont like it leave.. you think you can say and do repulsive things with impunity you cant if you want to express your disgusting opinions fine free country.. and i have a right to tell you you have sh&^ for brains and a rotten soul
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By Dan Anderson Questioning one's beliefs is NOT harassment. It is just that - questioning your beliefs.

Oh, so you admit you harass homosexuals because you lack the knowledge of your own bible? Amazing. You are nothing less than a hate-monger. Your actions do a great service to those who were questioning whether to be Christian or of another religion. You are pushing people AWAY quite well.
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By William Dykeman how do you know that? did you choose to be strait or were you born that way, dont be daft, your bible is wrong AGAIN!
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By Randy Bozarth Yes, I choose to be strait, because I know it pleases God.
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By William Dykeman so you have gay urges than? lol pervert
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By Randy Bozarth I do not have gay urges. If God said I should have sex with a man, I would be expected to do it. I am thankful he does not.
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By William Dykeman you know what i think you do and thats why you got angry, i hit a nerve.. its okay by the way embrace it
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By William Dykeman i think god wants you to give it a try.. lol man what a closet case you are!
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By Dan Anderson Randy - you CHOOSE to be straight (strait is not the word you are looking for)? At what age did you CHOOSE to be heterosexual?
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By Dan Anderson RAndy - so, if God says something, you should follow through, right? So if you ever have children and they become unruly, you will take these kids to the city fathers and have them stoned to death? The Bible commands that. If you lift a finger of work on the Sabbath, do your neighbors have your permission to stone YOU to death? How about if you touch the skin of a dead pig? Wearing cotton and polyester blend clothing? These, and more, are stoneable offenses to your perception of God.
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By Larry W. Gray Nobody cares what your Bible says, if you are in business with a business license to serve the general public. Close your shop and make cakes for the church.
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By Vincent D'Emidio "No one is born homosexual. It is a choice".

Typical Evangelical GARBAGE. This is why I say that Fundamentalist and born-again, ahem, "christians" are not TRUE Christians. You people (yes, I said, "you people") are just bible-bangers. You wanna see a TRUE Christian? then watch Pope Francis, and learn!
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By Randy Bozarth I do not force anyone to accept my faith. I can't anyway. Everyone has freewill. We are all free moral agents. Please do not force me to transgress my own faith. That is prejudice. That is discrimination against Christians.
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By William Dykeman yeah you do
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By Larry W. Gray Then don't run a public bakery. If you do, you are not allowed to discriminate on the basis of your religious hatreds and intolerances. So get over it.
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By Randy Bozarth Go to a different baker. I don't have hatred for anyone.
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By Larry W. Gray I don't want to have to find another baker. If your "Christian" baker has a business license, he will lose it when he refuses to accomodate a customer's perfectly normal and businesslike request for his services. If he doesn't like that, he should go into another business that will allow him to preserve his religious beliefs without hindrance. But he is running a business that deals with the general public, and, as such, requires him to follow the non-discrimination in business statutes.
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By Randy Bozarth If I was a baker, I would say that the homosexuals are trying to attack me because of my faith if they refuse to go to another baker. I would report them to the authorities for harassment. I have rights.
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By Larry W. Gray You don't have the "right" to discriminate in a publicly licensed business, it's against the law. Either bake the cake or find another way to make a living. Your "report" to the "authorities" would be replied to with hilarity! I can just hear them now...."Oh, dude, you GOTTA see this "report" that just came in.....LOL!!!!!!!
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By William Dykeman we will put you out of business
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By Dan Anderson Randy - So, I guess this means you have no problem with other forms of discrimination, like what happened in the U.S. up to the early 1960s, where restaurant owners refused to serve "people of color" purely because they had more melanin in their skin than you. You think that they should have also continued to this day having separate bathrooms and drinking fountains, too?

What you discriminate against homosexuals sounds one hell of a lot like hatred to me.
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By William Dykeman that doesnt sound very christian to me... jesus used to hang out with thieves and hookers
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By Randy Bozarth If you want to argue God's judgement on homosexuality, consult the bible, and argue with God, and see if you get anywhere. You want to judge me for my faith when you don't know it. God's judgement against homosexuality is righteous judgement. I think it should hold up in a court of law, but since it doesn't, it will continue to get worse in America.
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By Dan Anderson Randy - given that you do not understand the historicity of your own holy book, I am surprised that you do not think that Jesus was a literal rock. What kind of stone was he? He did not take things for Granite. Maybe he was marble?

Leviticus 18:22 and 20:13 were about condemning the Canaanite religious ceremonies which used temple prostitutes.

Romans 1:26- was about Saul/Paul's writings about the Roman fertility rituals to the Goddess Diana, which would end in an orgy. Had nothing to do with the love of two people who were of the same gender.

1Cor 6:9 - please check KJV1611. You will see the term "homosexual" is not there. It is only a recent addition to the Bible.