Topic: US Economy

Trump proposes $1000 for every American to cushion coronavirus blow. Good idea?

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Discussion started by Tok Staff:
With markets crashing and a global recession declared, Trump seeks to cushion the blow in an election year. Will this help or is this a waste of money?
Background article: ... Read more
Results in this view: Y-good Stimulus 100% - Convince Me 0% - N-waste Of Cash 0%
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By Wallace Freeman I'd rather get ALL of my tax money back but this will be a good start.
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By William Dykeman try to remember that it isnt your money if someone else needs those resources more
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By Kirby Liberty Harris lol, yes it is always his money.
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By William Dykeman socialists are fine till they run out of other peoples money to spend..
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By Kirby Liberty Harris Ah, you just admitted it was his money. Thief.
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By William Dykeman if you read the bible with even a weak understanding you conclude one thing god gave us the planet was stewards its his planet and everything on it is his and he left some pretty clear instructions “When someone steals another's clothes, we call them a thief. Should we not give the same name to one who could clothe the naked and does not? The bread in your cupboard belongs to the hungry; the coat unused in your closet belongs to the one who needs it; the shoes rotting in your closet belong to the one who has no shoes; the money which you hoard up belongs to the poor.”

― Basil the Great
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By Kirby Liberty Harris That is Basil, Basil was not God. That is Basil's opinion. I agree with Basil, but Basil was not talking through government, but voluntary charitable giving. Which I do.
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By Kirby Liberty Harris God also told us to disobey government laws when it violates God's law which includes abusing people (various ways they do that). He told us not to steal, that included through government. Making roads, police military, ect. isn't stealing.
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By Kirby Liberty Harris And even the legit expenses and government can be done completely voluntary, which violates nothing biblical.
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By Kirby Liberty Harris Besides you can't force biblical law on unbeleivers. That is immoral. God doesn't force, he invites and wants to want to do good things.
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By William Dykeman “When someone steals another's clothes, we call them a thief. Should we not give the same name to one who could clothe the naked and does not? The bread in your cupboard belongs to the hungry; the coat unused in your closet belongs to the one who needs it; the shoes rotting in your closet belong to the one who has no shoes; the money which you hoard up belongs to the poor.”

― Basil the Great
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By Wallace Freeman Wealth belongs to those responsible for its creation as but for their creativity it does not exist at all. Fear the day the creative are no longer desirous of the creation of wealth for there will be none for anyone else to enjoy. In other words, anger the goose that lays the golden eggs.
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By William Dykeman wealth belongs to everyone in a society no matter who produces it it is moral only i repeat moral only when it is distributed to those that need them, nothing you have is yours
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By Wallace Freeman Were that true, wealth would exist free for the taking, in unlimited supply, without someone expending their effort and time in its creation and preservation.

Socialist societies, not understanding this, generally experience a decline in wealth until all they're distributing are equal shares of poverty and its attendant misery.
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By William Dykeman well what about sweden, you can get rich after you pay 70% to the govt in taxes i'd be fine with that plenty of billionaire in sweden high taxes just makes them work even harder to get it, no one likes being poor, but you must shae the wealth baby, thats all we ask
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By William Dykeman um norway ? Add to that case this statistic from the recently released World Inequality Report: the government of Norway owns around 60 percent of the nation's wealth. In fact, state ownership in Norway is now nearly double what it is in China.Jan 18, 2018

The Norwegian State Owns Most Of The Country's Wealth ...https://www.peoplespolicyproject.org/2018/01/18/the-norwegian-government-owns-most-of-the-countrys-wealth/
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By Kirby Liberty Harris wealth belongs to everyone in a society no matter who produces it it is moral only i repeat moral only when it is distributed to those that need them, nothing you have is yours <<< NO That is theft
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By William Dykeman everything on this planet was given to us by a generous god and he says SHARE
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By Wallace Freeman LOL, Sweden's "socialism", https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0lxD-gikpMs Norwegian and Scandinavian socialism in general is a myth. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7yGpU-nxtIk
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By William Dykeman not really it dpends on how strict your defintion is theres no such thing as "true" socialism no one really has gooten very close, but sweden is closer to the defintion of socialism that just about any other nation http://mattbruenig.com/2017/07/28/nordic-socialism-is-realer-than-you-think/ Labor Market
But this is not true. In addition to their large welfare states and high tax levels, Nordic economies are also home to large public sectors, strong job protections, and labor markets governed by centralized union contracts.

Around 1 in 3 workers in Denmark and Norway are employed by the government.
Centrally-bargained union contracts establish the work rules and pay scales for the vast majority of Nordic workers.
These labor market characteristics are hardly neoliberal or quasi-libertarian, at least if we stick to typical definitions of those terms. The neoliberal tendency, as exemplified most recently by France’s Emmanuel Macron, is to cut public sector jobs, reduce job protections, and push for local rather than centralized labor agreements. For the US labor market to become more like the Nordics, it would have to move in the opposite direction on all of those fronts.
State Ownership
Even more interesting than Nordic labor market institutions is Nordic state ownership. Collective ownership over capital is the hallmark of that old-school socialism that is supposed to have been entirely discredited. And yet, such public ownership figures prominently in present-day Norway and Finland and has had a role in the other two Nordic countries as well, especially in Sweden where the government embarked upon a now-defunct plan to socialize the whole of Swedish industry into wage-earner funds just a few decades ago.

The governments of Norway and Finland own financial assets equal to 330 percent and 130 percent of each country’s respective GDP. In the US, the same figure is just 26 percent.
No one would argue that the Nordic countries are full-blown socialist countries, whatever that might mean. But it is also folly to pretend the only thing they have proven is that high taxes and large welfare states can work. Even on the narrow understanding of socialism as public ownership of enterprise, the Nordic countries are far more socialistic than most commentators seem to realize. American socialists who draw inspiration from their successes do so rightly.
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By William Dykeman With that four-part institutional breakdown as my guide, and inspired by Nathanial Lewis’s “scale of socialism,” I used data from the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD), the World Inequality Database, and Freedom House to build a “Democratic Socialism Score” for a variety of countries. Due to the limits of their databases, I could only score 36 countries. I would love to apply this score to all countries, but the data limits can’t be avoided.
https://www.currentaffairs.org/2019/12/the-data-show-that-socialism-works
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By Wallace Freeman EVERYTHING depends on definitions. With the chosen definition feces are gold bullion and everybody is full of it.
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By William Dykeman well there you go being fececious get it? feces? its a joke
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By William Dykeman god created everything everything belongs to him “When someone steals another's clothes, we call them a thief. Should we not give the same name to one who could clothe the naked and does not? The bread in your cupboard belongs to the hungry; the coat unused in your closet belongs to the one who needs it; the shoes rotting in your closet belong to the one who has no shoes; the money which you hoard up belongs to the poor.”

― Basil the Great
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By William Dykeman wealth belongs to everyone, it is the duty of the prodictive to share with those in need the old the lame children.. with your rights come duties
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By Wallace Freeman Wealth belongs to its creators.
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By Wallace Freeman I don't think anyone's religious tract, especially one that recognizes the institutions of slavery and monarchy while recommending genocide, is a valid basis for modern economics.
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By William Dykeman well yeah you have to take the goodwith the bad but yexs those are bad aspects of relgion, however tellnh people to share is not bad, it essential our our collective suruval
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By William Dykeman lets remember that the crusades to end slavery were led by Christians
the republicans that established this nation and irleand were depply religious people, and advocates for civl rights in the 1960s were crisitans, my family were depply relgious chritians and in ww2 they hid jews from the nazis so it is somewhat infair to claim chritians are guilty simpy because part of the ir historical narrtive discusses how things were in a barbaric time
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By Wallace Freeman And Hitler brought Germany out of depression, built the autobahns and got humanity into space using slave labor to build V-2s. Maybe Mein Kampf would be a good foundation upon which to build society as well.
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By William Dykeman hitler was not all bad, which is why the german people loved him till he started that insane war, its ugly to admit but jews were never loved in germany or anywhere, germans didnt care about them no one did thats why hitelr wasablse to get away with his crimes, the black hearts of common folk , and who were the slaves , communists, gypsies? people you yourself despise.. admit it you would have loved hitler.. yes hitler did amaing things hell stalin gave us sputnik and american was built on the bones of dead indians and africans and immigrants and yet we claim to be good.. all great societies are based on cruelty so said neitzche they have to be the secret is the values of that society do they ignore their crimes or do they admit them and try to reform? christians true chrstians admit they make mistakes repent ask forgivness and try to do better thats why we abolished slavery and to this day lament and point fingers at our ancestors for the way they mistreated women and minorities etc.. hitler would not apologize for what he did.. he though he was perfoming a public service, the way you tell god from evil is not be what was done.. to survie we all have done evil.. its how we feel about what we did.. do we show re,morse for our crimes? or are we angry we got caught. hitler was very angry he got caught, most germans showed remorse for their crimes and because they have its time to forgive them.. and chrisitanity
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By William Dykeman what ideology doesnt have millions of corpses around its victories? as neithzches said all great societies are based on cruelty
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By William Dykeman john browns body is a smoldering in the grave his truth keeps marching on
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